Comments on: I’m ready to talk about Illegals… http://redswingline.zamoose.org/2006/05/01/im-ready-to-talk-about-illegals/ Mumbling has never been so interesting Thu, 04 Dec 2008 03:37:06 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.5 By: awethern http://redswingline.zamoose.org/2006/05/01/im-ready-to-talk-about-illegals/#comment-165 awethern Tue, 02 May 2006 23:06:25 +0000 http://redswingline.zamoose.org/2006/05/01/im-ready-to-talk-about-illegals/#comment-165 I understand you are against making English the official language, but I think your reasoning is weak. You site a fear of the likely spanish-speaking majority being able to change the official language at some point in the future. Here is why that arguement fails to convince me: 1) In order for the Latino community to "take over the government", they need more then just to be "the majority". They need to be "the majority" all over the U.S, or at least 60% of it, and they need to be "the majority" by more then the current definition (right now, the predictions that call latinos a majority do not mean to say that latinos will surpass 50% in total U.S population. They mean to say that lations will be 32%, whites will be 31%, blacks will be 20%, and OTHER will comprise the final 17%. Yes, those numbers were pulled from the air). So - it's not bloody likely to occur. 2) IF, somehow, the latino community can band together enough votes in government to actually DO something about the official language, what makes you think they WOULDN'T do something about it if we continue to NOT have one? The reason I specifically called out Language and Money Transfers is because the overwhelming majority of Illegal immigrants (not just from the south, but many are) do not PLAN on staying here for long - they think they can make a quick buck and return home a king, which is why many don't bring their families. When reality smacks them in the face, they change their tunes only slightly, planning to return "As soon as I have enough money", and in the meantime, sending money back home. Because they never have the mindset of WANTING to become American, they don't try very hard to assimilate. America will ALWAYS welcome our brothers and sisters from abroad, but we can not accept those who try to force their will on us without accepting our ways. I understand you are against making English the official language, but I think your reasoning is weak. You site a fear of the likely spanish-speaking majority being able to change the official language at some point in the future. Here is why that arguement fails to convince me:

1) In order for the Latino community to “take over the government”, they need more then just to be “the majority”. They need to be “the majority” all over the U.S, or at least 60% of it, and they need to be “the majority” by more then the current definition (right now, the predictions that call latinos a majority do not mean to say that latinos will surpass 50% in total U.S population. They mean to say that lations will be 32%, whites will be 31%, blacks will be 20%, and OTHER will comprise the final 17%. Yes, those numbers were pulled from the air). So - it’s not bloody likely to occur.

2) IF, somehow, the latino community can band together enough votes in government to actually DO something about the official language, what makes you think they WOULDN’T do something about it if we continue to NOT have one?

The reason I specifically called out Language and Money Transfers is because the overwhelming majority of Illegal immigrants (not just from the south, but many are) do not PLAN on staying here for long - they think they can make a quick buck and return home a king, which is why many don’t bring their families. When reality smacks them in the face, they change their tunes only slightly, planning to return “As soon as I have enough money”, and in the meantime, sending money back home. Because they never have the mindset of WANTING to become American, they don’t try very hard to assimilate. America will ALWAYS welcome our brothers and sisters from abroad, but we can not accept those who try to force their will on us without accepting our ways.

]]> By: Andy II http://redswingline.zamoose.org/2006/05/01/im-ready-to-talk-about-illegals/#comment-164 Andy II Tue, 02 May 2006 21:24:00 +0000 http://redswingline.zamoose.org/2006/05/01/im-ready-to-talk-about-illegals/#comment-164 I am def. against making english the national language. Here is a link to my view as posted on Agent Orange's blog quite some time ago. The whole post is still quite relevant to this one: http://agentorange.zamoose.org/2006/01/18/ejumacation/#comment-734 I am def. against making english the national language. Here is a link to my view as posted on Agent Orange’s blog quite some time ago. The whole post is still quite relevant to this one:
http://agentorange.zamoose.org/2006/01/18/ejumacation/#comment-734

]]> By: awethern http://redswingline.zamoose.org/2006/05/01/im-ready-to-talk-about-illegals/#comment-163 awethern Tue, 02 May 2006 02:35:33 +0000 http://redswingline.zamoose.org/2006/05/01/im-ready-to-talk-about-illegals/#comment-163 The $1000 is indeed intended to be a one time only shot - I am sure there are ways of prooving it via unfalsifiable medical records or the like. The goal is to give them enough so that they can get restarted back "home". It may very well be a lot of money, but I guarrantee you the payback from medicine and services would be less then 2 years. And don't forget # 5 - we don't kick them out until we have the means to KEEP them out. ESL: That's not a bad thing. Anything to teach English. Likewise, there is nothing stopping any immigrant from taking a foreign language in school that also happens to be part of their heritage, if for no other reason then to be grammatically correct. Toca numero ocho: well, that one is here to stay. As I said above, no business should be prohibited from trying to make money, and language can help the transaction. Does it keep people from having to learn english faster? You bet. But not every place will have a numero ocho, and as also stated above, nothing paid for with federal, state, or local $$ will, outside of personal and public safety matters. As to the welfare system and those who are legal and use the emergency room for general medical needs - well, I'm letting that topic brew for a while. I have some ideas, and when they mature a little more, I may let them out. I will say this: I am a fan of the up-front payout for the lottery, and other systems where there is choice involved of longterm steady payout or one reduced (compared to long term) overall payout immediately. That is where I am headed, but I want to work out the nasty kinks first... The $1000 is indeed intended to be a one time only shot - I am sure there are ways of prooving it via unfalsifiable medical records or the like. The goal is to give them enough so that they can get restarted back “home”. It may very well be a lot of money, but I guarrantee you the payback from medicine and services would be less then 2 years. And don’t forget # 5 - we don’t kick them out until we have the means to KEEP them out.

ESL: That’s not a bad thing. Anything to teach English. Likewise, there is nothing stopping any immigrant from taking a foreign language in school that also happens to be part of their heritage, if for no other reason then to be grammatically correct.

Toca numero ocho: well, that one is here to stay. As I said above, no business should be prohibited from trying to make money, and language can help the transaction. Does it keep people from having to learn english faster? You bet. But not every place will have a numero ocho, and as also stated above, nothing paid for with federal, state, or local $$ will, outside of personal and public safety matters.

As to the welfare system and those who are legal and use the emergency room for general medical needs - well, I’m letting that topic brew for a while. I have some ideas, and when they mature a little more, I may let them out. I will say this: I am a fan of the up-front payout for the lottery, and other systems where there is choice involved of longterm steady payout or one reduced (compared to long term) overall payout immediately. That is where I am headed, but I want to work out the nasty kinks first…

]]> By: Agent Orange http://redswingline.zamoose.org/2006/05/01/im-ready-to-talk-about-illegals/#comment-162 Agent Orange Tue, 02 May 2006 01:35:12 +0000 http://redswingline.zamoose.org/2006/05/01/im-ready-to-talk-about-illegals/#comment-162 Glancing through the revisions I agree with almost everything you are saying. The one outlier is the 1000 for kicking them back across the border. first, 1000 bucks for x million immigrants is a lot of money that we "don't" have. taxpayers will not look well on giving money to people who broke our laws as they work their butts off to mae money in a law abiding manner. Second, they get 1000 bucks for getting across and being sent back, they cross again and get another 1000 bucks when they get sent back. I don't believe that there is a database economically sound enough to support facial recognition of those who have got the monetary stipend already so this could go on and on and on. This plan would actually make their current goal even easier. Break the law, make money. At least now they are in dirt and grime to make 5 bucks an hour. Giving them 1000 for crossing a line seems alot easier! English should be the national language, why am I the bad guy when I can't understand what a line worker is saying to me in the middle of the nation because they refused to learn the language of the land? Question for you, what can we do about the abetting society that we have become with the ESL programs and "press 2 for spanish"? And you can read my previous posts in reference to the welfare state that has been established as they are the backbone to this problem. They dont want to work, know they will get money anyways, so they leave the jobs to the immigrants who are not legal and will get paid much less which keeps the minimum wage low so the welfare people are not encouraged to work. viscious cycle, I know. Glancing through the revisions I agree with almost everything you are saying. The one outlier is the 1000 for kicking them back across the border. first, 1000 bucks for x million immigrants is a lot of money that we “don’t” have. taxpayers will not look well on giving money to people who broke our laws as they work their butts off to mae money in a law abiding manner. Second, they get 1000 bucks for getting across and being sent back, they cross again and get another 1000 bucks when they get sent back. I don’t believe that there is a database economically sound enough to support facial recognition of those who have got the monetary stipend already so this could go on and on and on. This plan would actually make their current goal even easier. Break the law, make money. At least now they are in dirt and grime to make 5 bucks an hour. Giving them 1000 for crossing a line seems alot easier!

English should be the national language, why am I the bad guy when I can’t understand what a line worker is saying to me in the middle of the nation because they refused to learn the language of the land?

Question for you, what can we do about the abetting society that we have become with the ESL programs and “press 2 for spanish”?

And you can read my previous posts in reference to the welfare state that has been established as they are the backbone to this problem. They dont want to work, know they will get money anyways, so they leave the jobs to the immigrants who are not legal and will get paid much less which keeps the minimum wage low so the welfare people are not encouraged to work. viscious cycle, I know.

]]>